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Post by Richard on Sept 10, 2004 18:18:51 GMT -5
This topic is like a rabbit to a sighthound. No matter how many times the bunny gets away, we just can't resist going after it. No, no.....an easier way of saying it: WHATEVER........[/i] I won't be getting sucked into this stupid debate again....<sigh>you'll never win..pinch collar users are all bad according to most of the narrominded stiffs out there and quite frankly, to me, it's a non event...I'd rather debate if the light goes out in my refridgerator when I close the door....at least I know there is only two answers to that one.... And the agree to disagree...nah, not an option here...it's all how you look at it... -Richard
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Post by Iluvmypup on Sept 10, 2004 19:23:34 GMT -5
Haha..I always get sucked up in these kind of debates and conversations. ;D I just wanted to say ONE MORE THING, and thats it. I don't think any of you are 'horrible, nasty, cruel' people just because you use pinch collars. To say the least. I wish there were more dog owners like you in this world. So keep it up, I hold a deep respect for each one of you. Okay, over and out. ;D
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Post by Rowan on Oct 2, 2004 3:11:41 GMT -5
I have never used them. But I also read an article that stated that prong collars were safer then choke chains.
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Post by Iluvmypup on Oct 2, 2004 10:47:18 GMT -5
I've read the same thing, and would say that if I were to ever use a training collar, I would use a prong over a choke.
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Post by Willow on Oct 2, 2004 11:07:37 GMT -5
I have never used them. But I also read an article that stated that prong collars were safer then choke chains. Even this is " debatable". Again, it depends on the dog and the person using it. Personally, I prefer the slip collar, because that is what I learned to train with and I always try that first to see how the dog reacts to it. If all I need is a light to medium correction, I will use the slip, but if the dog is like the one Brooke is dealing with, than I will automatically reach for the pinch collar. I let the dog dictate what collar I use. ;D
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Post by Iluvmypup on Oct 2, 2004 11:15:24 GMT -5
So are slip collars and choke collars the same thing? And I agree it depends on the person using it. I saw, to my horror, someone who was apparently never shown how to correctly use a choke this summer. He had it on the wrong way, I guess, since the choke did 'choke' but it didn't release. Thank goodness the owner was there to release it, or that poor dog could have choked to death.
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Post by Willow on Oct 2, 2004 11:32:40 GMT -5
So are slip collars and choke collars the same thing? Yes, but I prefer to use "slip" instead of "choke", because used correctly that's exactly what it does. The "choke" comes from people who are against them and who want every one to believe they "choke" the dog, just as I prefer "pinch" collar to "prong", because people who are against pinch collars, always call them "prong" collars and spread the falsehood that they "dig into the dogs neck" and cause damage. More dogs are "choked to death" wearing flat collars than any training collar, because people think they are benign and tie them where they can hang themselves.
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Post by Brooke on Oct 3, 2004 1:00:34 GMT -5
Exactly Loey. I hate the term prong to be honest. 9x out of 10 I call it a pinch...and 100% of the time when I am educating the leary but willing to learn.
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Post by Rowan on Oct 3, 2004 3:31:24 GMT -5
Would it be reasonable to say that the danger/negativity in any training aid/ equiptment is the mis use of using it, more then the actual training aid/equiptment it's self..
I have seen the worse in improper use of the pinch collar. I have felt the scars on a dogs neck becasue of improper use of the prong collar. Had nothing to do with the intended use and results of the prong collar it was the idiots holding on to the other end of the lead... Using it to teach recalls on a long line. GEESH....what could you expect for stupidity..... The results was a working dog that ate it's handler or anyone that ever gave it a command... I do very much understand where your coming from......
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Post by Richard on Oct 3, 2004 8:20:49 GMT -5
Had nothing to do with the intended use and results of the prong collar it was the idiots holding on to the other end of the lead... In a nutshell, that is it.... We've always promoted the attitude here that the type and breed/personality of the dog will dictate the type of training and tools/methods used....it comes back to that responsible dog ownership thing...if you take the time to understand the breed you've chosen and are willing to learn, you will know which method works best for you and your dog. -Richard
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Post by Iluvmypup on Oct 4, 2004 11:15:37 GMT -5
Okay, I'll use the phrase 'slip' instead of 'choke' now. I guess I've always called it a choke collar, because thats the only name I'd ever heard used for it. And I agree that it doesn't 'choke' the dog, unless of course the owner uses it that way (like hanging the dog up because of misbehaving... ). A quick pop wouldn't literally 'choke' the dog, I wouldn't think. Thanks for the info. ;D
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Post by Aussienot on Oct 5, 2004 18:23:33 GMT -5
I thought Slip collars were made of solid material (leather or cotton/nylon web) where as Check/Choke are metal chain? With a normal pop, the solid Slip collars give a softer, more 'constrictive' correction, whereas the chain gives a harder more 'pinchy 'correction.
The action is the same - collar and leash are loose except for a quick pop to correct, then back to loose, so maybe it's just semantics.
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Post by sibemom on Oct 5, 2004 19:45:02 GMT -5
Rowan I have a question, was this owner using to much force with teaching the recall and using the pinch collar? That is the collar I use and with the long line, but you have to know how to work it from a distance. I was curious because I have also used a slip collar and a long line, never had any problems. I have never had to do anymore than a light tug to get the dog to come with either collar, and since I do not believe that a flat collar is a training tool, I choose to use one or the other slip or prong, so these people must have been REEFING on that line to leave scars.
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Post by Willow on Oct 6, 2004 15:35:29 GMT -5
Hmmmmm....I honestly don't know Aussie, if a "slip" collar is a fabric one and a "choke" a metal. I have always called the fabric one a "fabric/cloth slip", and the metal a "metal/chain slip", but I could be wrong. I do know that the fabric collars don't release as well/quickly as the metal ones do, because the fabric doesn't "slip" like metal on metal, so I don't like to use them for actual training. I have some fabric ones too, though, for the times I want something just a little more than a flat collar. That's interesting though and I would like to know the answer to that question, because I HATE using a wrong term for something! Makes me feel like I don't know anything and I am an idiot.
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Post by Vickih on Oct 13, 2004 10:52:55 GMT -5
Reading with interest because I am considering a training collar for my dog...
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