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Post by masha on Sept 12, 2006 1:50:38 GMT -5
OK - my Ana has never been very easy in the car, getting very excited and barking loudly. Up to now it has seemed to be a sort of positive excitement - because we are taking her for a walk, or the car is exciting or whatever. Or that is what I thought. But just lately I have noticed that she is now reacting as though she is scared. She stands with her tail between her legs, frantically looking out the back window, and when a car comes up behind us she screams in utter panic, howling and creating, and trying to jump forward into the passenger seats. She also gets upset when the car lurches and she loses her footing. She has always been very reluctant to get into a car, so maybe she was always scared and I just did not understand her body language? Last night Brenz came to pick me up at work. Its about a half hour drive. He told me he had to drive with one hand over his ear as she was completely flipping out the entire way . I had to sit in the back with her on the way back, rubbing her chest to calm her, which worked, but she was still completely freaked out and not really responding to my presence. (we also got lost on the way home as Brenz was so freaked out, so the trip was much longer than it should have been ) Last week we were also driving at night, he completely lost his temper (she was freaking out and jumping onto our grocery bags) slammed the breaks on, jumped out and roared at her. I think he now understands that this is not necessarily the best reaction. Freaks me out also. Also rather unsafe. I have tried to get her to " down" in the back so she cant see out, but of course I only started doing this when she was already panicking so that was no good. I was wondering if I could set up a crate in the car, so she cant see out but maybe she would just panic worse, - she has never been in a crate. It is possible that we are now driving at night with her more than usual, or more driving on freeways.
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Post by willow on Sept 12, 2006 10:20:12 GMT -5
Comforting her when she is in this state of mind only re-inforces her behavior.
I would crate her so she can't look out the windows, jump around etc.
I don't know what kind of vehicle you have, but I can get a large airline type crate into the back seat of my car and by placing it sidewise on the seat with it up against the back of the front seat, it is stable.
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Post by kaos on Sept 12, 2006 19:33:27 GMT -5
Yes, I think I would try the crate too as the situation sounds a little unsafe with her loose at the moment and distracting the driver. You can even drape some cloth over the open side so she will hopefully feel secure. You could get her used to the crate indoors before trying it in the car, then just have it in the car and reward her for getting in and out without trying to go anywhere etc.
I also agree with Willow that she will be picking up on the human emotions going on in the car. Obviously any shouting or tension will scare her, and too much comforting she may interpret as you agreeing there is something to worry about. Try to be upbeat and businesslike in manner when dealing with travel, and try not to get apprehensive yourself (easier said than done I know).
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Post by masha on Sept 13, 2006 6:22:16 GMT -5
Good - I'll try getting her used to a crate. Also possibly giving her a bone to chew so she will down in the back of the car. I agree that comforting her reinforces the behaviour - but that night it was a matter of getting home at all ! Dealing with a freaked out husband at one end of the car, and a freaked out dog on the other
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Post by Dom on Sept 13, 2006 8:26:08 GMT -5
Sadie acted the same way during her first few rides. The day we brought her home my husband kept staring at me as she was bellowing. He asked me a few times if I was sure about my pick. I heard that Sheps could make a large variety of whines but she sounded like we were killing her. Even with the windows rolled up, people in the other cars were looking at us. I swear our ears where ringing after each trip. My husband bought himself ear plugs on the second trip. We didn't have a crate during that time, just a doggie seat belt/harness. I agree a crate would be a better option. We did what Kaos suggested. Before and after walks we would put her in the truck and just sit there. I didn't even start it at first. We would ignore her protests and praise after she calmed down. After she was calm getting in the truck I would start it and not move it. About a week in, we were taking short trips and increasing the distance. I did buy a pair of ear plugs for myself during the beginning. I brought a book with me to read when I was increasing the time she remained quiet in the truck on the drive way. I had to use a very low key praise or it would get her excited again. A quiet "good girl" or a short pet was what I used. She has a special chew bone that she only gets during trips. We just keep it in the truck and give her access to it when she rides. It seems to calm her. She was a puppy at the time so I am not sure how well that will translate to a older dog. I do think Ana is picking up on Brenz's tension so it may be better for you to start the process with just you and her. When you feel she is comfortable enough in the car you can add Brenz in as part of the process. Just make sure he has no caffiene before hand.
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Post by masha on Sept 14, 2006 1:39:47 GMT -5
Cool, this sounds like good advice. Especially about the ear plugs. And in seperating B out of the situation for a while. We dont have a crate at the moment, but I think it would be a good idea to get one anyway. Funny thing was, when she was a pup, for the longest time, she never made a sound in the car. Just sat there quietly. And she's the type of dog who "talks" at the least provocation. At dog club, whenever we do distance controll, she sort of goes through all the moves, all the time having this long conversation with me: "SIT" mumble mumble whoooo whoa WAF " dOWN" hhhhhhrrrrrmmmm waf waf MUMBLOOOOOO wap. "STAND" OoooOOOoooh Warmbrmbrmbm. Bom. BROM. hrrrm. HOOOOO. hooooo. "SIT" etc.
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Post by Dom on Sept 14, 2006 8:24:32 GMT -5
At dog club, whenever we do distance controll, she sort of goes through all the moves, all the time having this long conversation with me: "SIT" mumble mumble whoooo whoa WAF " dOWN" hhhhhhrrrrrmmmm waf waf MUMBLOOOOOO wap. "STAND" OoooOOOoooh Warmbrmbrmbm. Bom. BROM. hrrrm. HOOOOO. hooooo. "SIT" etc. I love the vocalizations that Sheps have. All the rest of my dogs only barked, whined, or growled. The tone would change but they never "talked" like Sadie does. The different sounds give a dog such character.
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Post by sibemom on Sept 14, 2006 8:57:56 GMT -5
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Post by Dom on Sept 14, 2006 11:36:45 GMT -5
AHHHHH Dom That talking is not coming from the SHEPPY that talking is coming from the SIBE I tend to forget the rescue said Sadie was mixed with Husky. There have been numerous occasions she would make her little hoots and my husband and I would look at each other wondering what the noise came from. Last night she was patrolling the yard and made the oddest howl/whistle/hoot. It was Sadie talking to a centipede that was getting too close to our back door. I swear she sounded like a Howler monkey. Sibemom, I know your worry about a dog getting lose after an accident. I wasn't worried until I spoke to the owner of a Holistic pet shop I visit. She breeds Mastiffs and sold one of the pups to a friend. The friend was in one of those new Beatles and got rear ended by a truck when turning into the owners shop. The poor pup (about 9 months) bolted into the woods. The owner was sick with worry and posted reward flyers everywhere. They finally found the pup about a month later. She wandered up to a farm not far from my house. She was very thin and covered in ticks but okay. A seat belt harness or crate is a small investment to insure the safety of a pet during times like that. Speaking of which, I need to get one for Elsie for when we take both of them on a trip. Masha, sorry for sidetracking your thread.
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Post by masha on Sept 14, 2006 12:47:34 GMT -5
No - no sidetracking involved! this is very interesting. I've heard of those seatbelt affairs for dogs, not sure where to get one here. I'm sure they are available though. I find it interesting that using a crate in the car seems to be quite common? As I said, I never crate trained her and dont have one, but I probably should have and maybe its not too late to starts something along those lines. Oh, that is too cute. Ana is especially vocal when she feels hard done by, with a specially feeling "brrrmmbrooooo" making her point. Like the time she finaly decided to be friendly to our older cat, (as opposed to barking at her) which, of course, involves poking a big friendly wet cold dog nose in her face. When she got zapped, she sort of sat back in total surprise, stared quietly for a little bit, then walked off - looking over her shoulder and "whooo. WHoooobrrmoooming" all the way in such a hurt way.
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Post by Dom on Sept 14, 2006 13:12:07 GMT -5
I didn't crate train Sadie either. I never thought a crate was cruel or anything. I just didn't have any experience with them. After we got Elsie, we decided to try one out. It was the BEST training tool we could have gotten for her. I thought it would be difficult but is was very easy to crate train her. The training was definitely less time consuming that the 24/7 "potty watch" we did when we first got Sadie. We actually have two crates right now. One in our bedroom and one in the living room. We leave them open and Elsie will go in them to rest even if we don't tell her too. It is her "safe zone". It also is the place she can safely stash toys and bones because Sadie is to big to get to them. And boy has she tried. I got a wire crate that folds down. It makes it much easier to move and store. I did have a plastic one but it was such a pain to move the bulky thing from place to place. I also liked that the crate came with a divider so you can adjust the size of the crate as the dog grows. Elsie isn't growing but the Med was almost too small and the next size up is really too big. I will see if I can find a link to the crates we have. I bought the seat belt harness at the store down the road. I am sure you can find a nice selection on line.
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Post by Dom on Sept 14, 2006 13:25:39 GMT -5
This is the crate we use: www.petedge.com/shopping/product/detailmain.jsp?itemID=3255&itemType=PRODUCT&iMainCat=733&iSubCat=741&iSubSubCat=742&iProductID=3255I would try to find a crate in a store near you though. That way you can take Ana to check the size. Also, it will be easier to return if you decide on something else. The shipping charges are around $30 so the over all cost of the crate would probably be cheaper in the store. The above link is where we bought one of the crates. I am still new to crates myself. I was going to buy one of the cloth folding crates but Elsie is a chewer. I would come home with just the frame of the crate left. I am glad someone recommended a fold down crate. I think it might have been willow who asked about crates. I never knew they had crates that folded down. It is so much easier to get them out of the way when you need the space. Elsie did not like not being able to see out of the plastic crate we had. We changed to a wire and she was fine. I would think the wire crate is more versatile in that respect. You can always cover the wire crate if the dog feels more comfortable with it closed in. You can't take the plastic off the plastic crates.
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Post by masha on Sept 15, 2006 3:13:08 GMT -5
This sounds great. She loves lying in little confined spaces, since she was a pup she always crawled into a cupboard or under a bed. Now she is quite a big dog, and the cupboards are too small! Thanks for the link.
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Post by Faith on Sept 15, 2006 11:38:58 GMT -5
Well call me different,cause i love taking my dog for a ride as much as the next person, but have you thought about leaving her home? I mean if it is causing that much trama for her, Maybe it would be best. But if thats just not an option, the crate is a very good idea. my old dog loved her crate. its like a den for them it think. But if you don't have one already get her a kong for the ride. It will give her something to do to take her mind off of being it the car.
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Post by espencer85 on Sept 19, 2006 11:32:51 GMT -5
The dog gets nervous because the world is "moving" around the car but she is not, very important not to get the dog inside the car if she is nervous, you have to calm her down first and then get her in
Tell a friend to drive you both around the block, get in the back seat with your dog and apply a correction (with the leash for example) if your dog starts getting nervous again, you can take the dog in and out the car before is on so the dog feels that nothing happens when she gets in, and like i said, after she gets used to get inside the car normally and is calm then you can start the car and do the excercise
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