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Post by sibemom on Aug 25, 2004 7:12:44 GMT -5
Here is something that I would like to discuss. Last Friday, a neighbors dog was attacked by a young GSD male, fully intact. The GSD attacked a Schizu, who was tied up in it's own yard. The attack was severe and the little dog might have to be put down if it does not get better by the weekend. Here is the thing that disturbs me. This guy with the GSD knows full well that his dog is dog aggresive, and still allows him to be free in his unfenced yard. I know this dog well his name is Tyson, and he is the sweetest animal you would ever want to meet, but he does have aggresion issues with SMALL DOGS. I have walked Blade in that area more than once and Tyson would come out and never once tried to start anything with Blade, all he wanted to do was play. Well of course I feel extremly bad for the owners of Murphy the Schizu, because they were being responsiable and keeping him in their own yard. Animal Controll issued the GSD owner a citation, and also of course he will have to pay the vet bills, but they told him that if Murphy has to be PTS, Tyson will too. That makes me sick and I would love to go over and beat the crap out of his owner. This was HIS fault, not the dogs. There have never been any issues with this dog except this one. I know if I was Murphy's owner I would probably agree with that decision but how unfair for Tyson. I know there is a saftey factor here, but why do people not understand that if you know your dog has these kinds of issues you keep them contained. Why the idiot did not neuter Tyson, is beyond me. I am hoping that Murphy comes through this, but it is very doubtful. I think if the dog would have been trained right from the beggining this would have never happened. Why do the dogs have to suffer because of a stupid owner.
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Post by Willow on Aug 25, 2004 7:38:13 GMT -5
As usual, it's the owner of Tyson who needs to be pts.
But, seriously, and I know I will get a lot of "flack" for this, but a lot of GSD's are aggressive towards other dogs, just small dogs, and/or with "prey animals" etc., and anyone who wants a GSD should be aware of this and take precautionary steps to control it. Of course, neutering is the first step, but that alone will not solve the problem, especially now since he has already attacked the small dog.
What I see that happens in a lot of these cases is that the owner puts up an escape proof kennel in the back yard and that's where the dog spends the rest of his life, getting more and more aggressive until he/she finally tries to attack a person or child, and then the dog is put down.
Yes, it's unfair when it isn't the dogs fault, but the owner's, but the truth of the matter is....how many owner's (except you and Richard) really understand the breed before they get one and take the necessary steps to control the dog before something like this happens!?
I blame incidents like this, not only on the owner, but on the breeder, who should do everything in their power to breed out any aggressive tendencies, and for not screening the potential owner's to make sure they know all about the breed and how to "handle" them.
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Post by Richard on Aug 25, 2004 7:45:33 GMT -5
Ok, lets do the equation thing here:
stupid owner with no training skills or common sense+ 1 intact, untrained, small dog aggressive GSD +no fenced yard = GSD being put to sleep
Oh yes, I can see how fair that is...but the real answer should be:
= Stupid owner with no training skills or common sense should be PTS
They always blame the dog....where was the breeder in all of this..he shoulda screened out that idiot too....
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Post by amyjo on Aug 25, 2004 7:50:25 GMT -5
I hate to see a dog PTS for something that isn't really his fault (he's a dog and nobody taught him better or contained him so that he wouldn't have an opportunity to be aggressive)
But I don't see this owner containing or working with this dog - so I don't really know what the answer is - because with out intervention - it's just gonna get worse from here!
I am torn. Its wrong and it sucks to put this dog to sleep buuuuut what is the solution? At the very least I feel this man doesn't deserve this dog and like Loey I would like to put the man to sleep! However - you take the dog away and then what? He becomes another homeless dog the shelter system can't handle and gets PTS.
I just don't know... It is so sad and frustrating.
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Post by sibemom on Aug 25, 2004 7:53:13 GMT -5
That is what makes me so mad. Even if they do not put Tyson to sleep I don't think this guy should be allowed to keep him. As I said he is very social to people, but Loey you are right, if he is remanded to keep him in a kennel or tied up on a chain he will get worse, and especially if he does not neuter him. I feel awful for that little dog. Blade is not dog aggresive but I still am cautious with him around small dogs. His play drive is very strong and just in the heat of play he could do damage. Willow has a few issues with strange dogs but we work on that, and I am teaching her to ignore other dogs. Having her grow up with another dog helps, but that does not mean she is going to love every dog she comes in contact with so I manage that. I made her accept the small dog next door and they are now freinds, but I still would never leave her loose with it because again that strong prey/play drive that they have. I hope the situation turns out good for both dogs but like I said if Tyson is left with this guy nothing good will come of it. I told him before that his dog needs some training because even though he has always been good with Blade and I, I have seen him get aggitated around other small dogs. Yes can't we put the owner to sleep, to me that would be the best solution.
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Post by Richard on Aug 25, 2004 8:11:31 GMT -5
I am torn. Its wrong and it sucks to put this dog to sleep buuuuut what is the solution? At the very least I feel this man doesn't deserve this dog and like Loey I would like to put the man to sleep! However - you take the dog away and then what? He becomes another homeless dog the shelter system can't handle and gets PTS. Yes, but you get him away from that loser of an owner - who will most probably be sued royally by the schitz's owners, then he blames the dog and Tyson will get even more neglected or worse, abused. At least he's got a chance in a foster home for a while...I know, that doesn't make it any better does it...still, this guy should be court ordered to not own any more dogs at all in his lifetime (or the rest of his lifetime in He!! too). Overall, this $uck$ mostly cuz the dog gets it in the end as well as another knock against GSD's....it's not frustrating amyjo, it's a shame, a real shame....
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Post by sibemom on Aug 25, 2004 8:13:23 GMT -5
I guess I should have added to I do feel a little guilty because he had asked me awhile ago if I would work with Tyson, and I told him straight out NOT UNTILL YOU GET HIM FIXED, and that was'nt the only reason. What ever I would have done to train this dog, would have been lost because the owner just has not clue. So yeah I guess I feel even worse because maybe I could have got somewhere, but with his manhood still being in place I knew I would never get his complete attention because he is about 1 1/2. His stupid response was that he wanted him to be all male not a sissy well you got your all male buddy, and I hope you are happy I have'nt talked with him yet BUT I WILL
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Post by Willow on Aug 25, 2004 10:58:00 GMT -5
I am torn. Its wrong and it sucks to put this dog to sleep buuuuut what is the solution? At the very least I feel this man doesn't deserve this dog and like Loey I would like to put the man to sleep! However - you take the dog away and then what? He becomes another homeless dog the shelter system can't handle and gets PTS. Yeah, and the idiot owner just goes out and gets another dog and does the same thing with it.
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Post by ripley on Aug 25, 2004 15:47:14 GMT -5
Stupid, stupid, stupid. I don't think the dog should be PTS. (whoever said the owner should be PTS = ) If you ask me, take Tyson away from the owner, do extensive temperament testing, and re-home him with someone responsible and experinced with drivey GSD's. (GSD rescue anyone? Why does it always have to be the pound?)
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Post by amyjo on Aug 25, 2004 16:19:19 GMT -5
Right or wrong - the rescue group I work for would never take on a dog that had killed another dog.
I don't know anything about GSD rescue - but I find it hard to imagine you could locate a rescue group that would take him on.
Further - rescuing the dog from the situation that "caused" his aggression is in no way a "cure" for the aggression and there is no way to gaurantee this won't happen again.
I don't want to see this dog put to sleep - but realistically - if you leave him with his current owner more aggression is a done deal - his best bet is a private placement with somebody who knows what they are doing, is willing to assume the risks and has a proven track record so that the greiving owners of Murphy and the public at large can be reasonably assured this won't happen again.
I don't want to write the dog off....I really don't - but where do you go from here?
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Post by sibemom on Aug 25, 2004 16:28:13 GMT -5
You are exactly right Amy. What I am thinking though is maybe he should contact the breeder he got him from. I don't know where this guy is at with the situation and I don't know what Murphy's owners are going to ask be done with Tyson if Murphy has to be PTS, but I would think getting in touch with the breeder would be a good start. I know that there is no way to cure this problem but the right person could manage it. I don't know where the dog came from, except it did not come from the same kennel that Willow did THANK GOD. So yeah this is a no win all the way around. Rescue might take him, but is this guy willing to call them.
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Post by ripley on Aug 25, 2004 17:16:35 GMT -5
I have to say, though, if it was MY little dog that was attacked in his own yard by a neighbor's dog, I'd be in favor of having that dog removed from the neighborhood... Amyjo you're right, most rescues won't take a dog that has killed another dog, but I know of several private rescues that take in dogs with a bite history or aggression problems that are on 'death row' and place them in a suitable, experienced and responsible foster home to be really evaluated. I don't know of any in Wisconsin, but there are several in Idaho just in my area.. Man, this situation sucks royally. That guy should NEVER have gotten a GSD, he obviously wasn't prepared to spend time with Tyson and is an IDIOT for not containing an unneutered male dog. I really do hope Murphy pulls through..
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Post by Willow on Aug 25, 2004 18:22:51 GMT -5
his best bet is a private placement with somebody who knows what they are doing, is willing to assume the risks and has a proven track record so that the greiving owners of Murphy and the public at large can be reasonably assured this won't happen again. Ideally that would be the best, but where do you find these type of owner's? Rescue's all over are on the lookout for them, but they are elusive. ;D
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Post by sibemom on Aug 27, 2004 5:18:57 GMT -5
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