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Post by sibemom on Jul 16, 2004 18:23:45 GMT -5
Ok Willow has been on total raw now for a few days, before it was kibble/raw. Well she is having some very loose stools. This morning as I posted in another thread she had an accident in her crate, first time in a LONG TIME. I have been feeding her ground turkey one meal and a chicken leg quarter the next. I have not added anything else just yet. She is getting about 12oz of food per day, she would eat 5#'s if I gave it to her because she is a PIG Here is the question should I wait to add some cooked long grain rice to her food as a stool firming agent and also a filler, or should I just give it more time. See Nicki even though I have been feeding raw to Blade for quite awhile the pup has me a little stumped. Any helpful hints will be appreciated ;D
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Post by fireworksinjuly on Jul 16, 2004 19:47:11 GMT -5
I wont be much help at all on the raw feed concept all I know is that ground meats have more of a chance of getting bacteria in them. When ground they are exposing a ton of surface to air and can easily catch bacteria. This usually goes away with cooking it, but as raw food it is posible to still be on the meat...
Chicken doesnt have this problem as much beacause it has less surface area that is exp[osed to air...
that probably has absolutly nothing to do with your probelm though so just ignore me...
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Post by Aussienot on Jul 16, 2004 21:38:07 GMT -5
Since she's still a puppy, I think I'd add a little rice now. If she was older, I might let nature take it's time to balance out, but with a less developed digestive system I would try to help.
The bacteria issue gets thrown around a lot. Bacteria's not all good or bad, and it needs to be taken in the context of the dog's digestive process, not a human's. The level of bacteria is relative. Have a handful of kibble that's been sitting in a bag analysed, then we can talk about bacteria.
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Post by sibemom on Jul 17, 2004 5:45:31 GMT -5
Thanks Aussie I wasnt worried about the bacteria issue but your right it does get thrown around alot. I think today I will add some rice to her afternoon meal and see what happens. Her stool was pretty runny this morning not diareha, but pretty loose. She did not have any accidents though THANK GOODNESS, so at least that part has gotten better I am going to hold off on adding eggs etc... untill I get this under controll. Keep your fingers crossed ;D
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Post by Willow on Jul 17, 2004 7:27:10 GMT -5
Since it's only been 3 days, it will probably resolve itself, but, personally, I think what I would try is adding more bone first, before the rice, but that's just "me". What I do sometimes, when I feed the ground turkey is add a half of a chicken breast with most of the meat taken off, with it. I can buy them down at the local grocery store as such...called "soup bones". Later, when the looseness resolves itself, you can go back to just the ground turkey if you want. I'm sure it's not a "bacteria thing" either. BIG misconception that the raw meat bacteria causes illness in dogs...or humans when they handle it, for that matter. With humans, as long as you use "normal" precautions like washing counter's, boards, hands after handling the meat there should be no problem. I kow a lot of people who are not even that careful and who have never gotten sick from it. It depends a lot on the immune system. There's such a thing as being TOO clean! ;D
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Post by sibemom on Jul 17, 2004 8:27:39 GMT -5
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Post by amyjo on Jul 17, 2004 9:43:30 GMT -5
I totally agree that concerns over bacteria are waaaay overblown... But I also think the ground food indeed DOES have more bacteria then whole food and so....if you are feeding ground on a daily basis - it could become a question not of bacteria in the food but of too much bacteria in the food- thus too much bacteria in the dog.
There was a woman not long ago on raw feeding who was feeding ground every day and both her dogs has swollen lymph nodes....folks suggested that before she freak out and run to the vet - she should try whole food only for a few days...it worked.
I too would not use rice... Like Loey - that is just "me"...but if you believe a dog is a carnivore then I just don't think that grain is going to help a sick carnivore recover... nor do I think it really has a place helping the dog transfer to raw... It seems a little counter productive to me... I mean I guess you could slowley taper it off - but I don't think it is necessary.
I also think we need to relax on the whole poop "thing" what goes in is what comes out. Raw poop - especially if feeding variety will be different every day unlike kibble poop. Organ poop can be a bit runny and black...meaty meat poops can also be soft and runny.. and bony poop can be dry and crumbly. My dogs occaisonally have drips and squirts which I just shrug off (there is a difference between loose poop and spastic, uncontollable, projectile poop).
I guess what I am saying is that if the dog eats the same thing day in and day out and then suddlenly the poop is runny then yeah...there might be a problem....but when you feed raw you have to learn that soft or loose poop is a reflection of what went into the dog and not ALWAYS a sign of trouble.
I would add more bone before I would add rice. I do undertand you have to be careful with pups because they can't "block" excess minerals like adult dogs - so you can OD them on bones (over time) and effect growth. I am not sure what the reccommended limits are though
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Post by sibemom on Jul 17, 2004 10:50:12 GMT -5
Thanks for the input I am going to try and follow the Leerburg raw plan for now except with the supplements, because I do not fee they are needed. I checked it over pretty good and I think it was me not #1 feeding enough, and #2 not feeding enough bone. So we will see if this makes a diffrence. I know now that she needs 2.5 #'s of food each day and that can be a combination of RMB and the ground. Like I said she is looking alot healthier, blindingly shiney coat, but needs a little more weight. I will get it balanced eventually ;D
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