|
Post by sibemom on Feb 19, 2004 6:19:44 GMT -5
I went outside to give Blade his dinner and it almost turnned into his LAST MEAL. We have been going back and forth with this rough play behavior for a LONG TIME. He is not food aggresive in any way shape or form, but I brought his dish out and when I set it down he went PSYCO He started that clothes grabbing, skin pinching, insane behavior that we have been working on getting rid of from day one. I tried to make him sit and wait but he was to crazed. I set the dish down behind me and this is where he almost lost his life. He came running at me full force all 70#'s of him >:(and I brought my knee up and it just connected. He fell backward with a thud then got up and did it again. This went on couple of times, untill I grabbed him and YES I did the alpha roll . I held him there untill he screamed. When it was over I told him to sit and wait. OH MY GOD HE DID. I would not recomend rolling a dog but at this point we had no choice. I had a whole new dog after this session was over. He has to learn that this behavior will not be tolerated. I took his food back in and waited a good hour before I fed him. When I brought it back out again and I said sit wait that is exactly what he did. He forgets himself sometimes and that is why I am there to remind him.
|
|
|
Post by Richard on Feb 19, 2004 7:23:11 GMT -5
Ann,
You just showed Blade one of the simpler rules of life:
THOU SHALL NOT PI$$ OFF THE ALPHA DOG!!
You (like me) just have to remind our dogs who is running the show occasionally....it doesn't happen often, but the correction is motivational enough to let them know that it will not be tolerated again.
As we talked about before, when the dog feels he's bigger than the alpha, you need to show him that is not the case...Ann, if you felt in control doing the roll at that point and it got the desired results, then the message was received by Blade loud and clear.
These acts of sillyness, defiance, or pushing the handlers buttons don't happen often cuz of how well you've trained Blade so far but I still think he (like Rocky) figures he can test the waters once in a while...well, guess what, IT AIN'T HAPPENING HERE!!!
-Richard
|
|
|
Post by Nicole on Feb 19, 2004 9:17:44 GMT -5
Ann, sometimes you just have to do what you have to do. This exchange will probably have a lasting effect which is exactly what you want. When Reign was a young pup, he would literally try to rip my clothes off every single encounter that we had. He was a nasty, stubborn little pup. The more I tried to stop him, the more he would come after me. Well one day I had had enough. Without really thinking, I grabbed him and held him down on his back until he was still. The next time he came at me, I just looked at him and he stopped dead in his tracks. I can't describe it in words other than to say that that moment changed and defined our relationship. I am not sorry that I did that. Now, as a disclaimer, I will say that I do not recommend that this be done as a training method, that it is a direct challenge for a fight to the dog, that Alpha and mamma's do not forcefully flip their pups to discipline them and that you can get your face bit off.
|
|
|
Post by Brooke on Feb 19, 2004 14:46:57 GMT -5
THOUGH SHALL NOT PI$$ OFF THE ALHPA DOG!! Richard I'm going to frame this and hang it in my home.
|
|
|
Post by Brooke on Feb 19, 2004 14:55:22 GMT -5
As Dr Phil would say, "how's that workin' for ya?" I agree....sometimes you just have to do what you have to do Ann. I think you've been pretty patient with him. You've done a good job but he's needing a bit of a firmer hand I guess...
I don't recommend the Alpha Roll ever to others for saftey reasons infact I discourage it but thats not to say that I personally haven't used it before either. I think if you know your dog well enough you can judge the outcome pretty well. I think you did fine.
|
|
|
Post by Willow on Feb 19, 2004 15:02:22 GMT -5
Sometimes *hands on* training, literally, is what it takes to get the message across and to convince them that you mean business. I would much rather see someone use this type of correction, than ignore the behavior or give half hearted corrections that have no meaning to the dog. Correct quickly with whatever force is necessary, and then it's over with and you forget about it.
That's why so many dogs end up at Shelter's and Rescue's. Owner's are afraid to use whatever it takes to stop the behavior right now, and once and for all, because they think it's cruel and that a *time out* will work. This is not dealing with reality and if anyone tells you you can solve every behavioral problem by ignorring it, or distracting the dog etc., they are living in a dream world and do not have experience with a lot of different dogs and in real life situations.
I have not had to do this for many, many years (thankfully), because I doubt I could do it on a large dog anymore, or even a med. sized dog. Maybe a Chihuahua ;D , but our FT Lab was a hard headed dog who decided now and then that he knew more than we did, and it would lead to a physical confrontation. What we did was grab him behind the ears and on the top of the butt and pick him up off the ground and shake him, all the while saying, *what do you think you're doing?*. This is different than a scruff shake, which I don't happen to believe works on adult dogs, and you don't have to shake hard. Dogs do not like their feet off the ground. They feel out of control and vulnurable. This really gets their attention, and impresses on them that you are ALPHA with a capitol A, plus it's impossible for them to turn around and bite you.
|
|
|
Post by Willow on Feb 19, 2004 15:05:56 GMT -5
Richard I'm going to frame this and hang it in my home. Yes, I agree. This is Classic!!!
|
|
|
Post by sibemom on Feb 19, 2004 15:34:31 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Willow on Feb 19, 2004 15:49:36 GMT -5
I would say you convinced him you are bigger and meaner than he is and do not like what he was doing, even if it was all in *fun*.
|
|
|
Post by sibemom on Feb 21, 2004 4:43:52 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by bobbenson on Feb 3, 2007 10:24:56 GMT -5
I have a 5 month old boxer puppy who plays very rough. I've had him for a little over one week. It's a breed thing. Anyway, I seem to have control when I am alone with him. He plays and bites but doesn't go extremely crazy. I'm home all the time working out of the house. When my wife comes home, he will run get very excited and play very rough. On several occasions, he has gotten a running start from across the room and jumped and punched my wife in the chest with his paws hurting her.
I suspect one of the reasons things escelate when my wife comes home is I'm calm and firm with him during the day, but when he injures my wife, I get upset. Also, certainly it has something to do with her. At the moment, I'm trying putting him in a puppy proof room for 5 minutes when he starts playing to rough. I just started that and don't know if it is going to work or not.
Here's the question though - is a 5 month old puppy to young to understand the roll over technique described in this thread? I tried it once, but he just thought I was playing rough and liked it. Perhaps I did not hold him long enough?
|
|
|
Post by sibemom on Feb 5, 2007 9:05:44 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by bobbenson on Feb 5, 2007 11:59:33 GMT -5
I think you have a lot of good advice there sibemom. Thanks. One question, asking a 5 month old pup to sit, how long can you expect him to sit for? In my case it seems to be no more that 5 seconds and he gets distracted. I've also only had him for 10 days now, and he didn't even know what sit was when I got him. He is secure in sit and 80% secure in know what down is now. My biggest problem is training my wife. Particularly since she wears the pants in the family. I'm making a little bit of progress in that area as well though. Yesterday when she came home from work, I put a choke chain and leash on him and sat on the couch with her. He did his usual jumping up and going crazy routine and I corrected him. Within 5 minutes he was sleeping next to her, so that worked well. As you said, the roll over didn't work and he thought he was playing. When I had my last Boxers, I played rough with them, but I was young and a bachelor and that was fun. It never created aggression in the dogs, but they liked to play rough. They didn't do the jump up thing, so I must have corrected that somehow. They only played rough when I got on the ground and wrestled with them. I like your advice of starting the roll over when he is calm and growing into it. That seems to make a lot of sense. Thanks again for a very helpful post.
|
|
|
Post by sibemom on Feb 5, 2007 12:49:35 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Dom on Feb 5, 2007 14:23:11 GMT -5
|
|