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Post by Baileysmom on Aug 2, 2004 20:08:40 GMT -5
HI - Im a new member, and wondered if you could give me some ideas ....... Bailey is our 10 mo old beagle mix we adopted at 8 mo. I took her through clicker training and she seems to learn really quickly and did really well. however an ongoign problem we are having is dealing with her when someone comes to the door. she starts barking and growling and lunging at the door! if the person walks in she wont attack or anything but she will continue barking and growling a bit. the major problem is when they are at the door - she gets so out of control that she doesnt listen to commands, and ofcourse the people at the door are scared and think I have a n awful dog! what should I be doing or how should I deal with this? thanks so much!
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Post by Richard on Aug 3, 2004 10:52:09 GMT -5
Hi there, I don't use a clicker so I can't really comment from that aspect...Iluvmypup will probably be your best source there. I can though, comment on the jumping at the door thing. At 10 months, your dog is showing that she can handle the security side of things for your house. What you need to get across to her is that once she does her thing (alerting you that there is someone at the door) she can relax and let you handle whoever is there. What happens is that she's not proofed yet to know when enough is enough. And once the guests are inside, she should definitely know to back off and relax in a down/stay somewhere. That is where the training comes in. She needs to know she can have a few barks at the door when someone comes to it (afterall, that is part of their job), but once you say, "enough" or "quiet" or even "thank you", you should start getting her into a down/stay a few feet away from the door until your guests get inside. The growling part, well, that shouldn't be tolerated at all. The hardest part (and this is something we still work on this with Rocky - keeps him on his toes especially when we have older guests visiting - he loves visits from family members!! ), is keeping them in the down/stay while the door is open - or once it's closed to get them to hold it while your guests are moving in from the doorway. Since you've worked with the clicker, you'll have some skills as to how to get her to work the down/stay. If you have started that, then continue doing it. The other thing that will need to be done is to have a leash near the door for when people do come over (no, not for the visitors, for your dog ). When there is someone at the door, leash up your dog after she gets her barks in and then work your down/stay command. Sometimes, you will need to go back and enforce it a few times but if you've told your guests what you're trying to accomplish, they'll be happy to wait a extra minute or two (besides, if its a sales person of some sort, they can wait longer). Once again, your dog is only doing what she thinks she should do. Your job will be to let her do that, but under your control. This is a skill that takes some time to learn and work but the results are excellent once you two get the routine down. Over to you luv.... -Richard ps...nuthin' moves a salesperson faster than seeing a 92lb GSD in a down/stay 10 feet away from the front door....if the person is insistant and won't take no for an answer, I just point and say, "here, you can talk to the manager if you wish".....he wouldn't hurt a fly but they get the message and move on!
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Post by Iluvmypup on Aug 6, 2004 15:41:15 GMT -5
K9Rocky brought up some really, really good points. How much clicker training has she gone through so far? Has she learned just the basics, or has she gone on to learning longer stays, quiet, speak, and so on?
Like k9 Rocky said, keep working on the Down-Stay. I like to keep a special blanket thats one room away from the front door. It gives me enough space to let the visitors in without my dog being too close that he can't resist getting up to get pet.
Remember, just because Bailey knows to DOWN-STAY at home, in your presence, does not mean she'll do the same under distractions. I would slowly build up the distractions. Maybe bounce a ball. Is she okay with that, or does she break the stay? Try walking over, rolling the ball down the hallway, dropping treats on the floor...these are all pretty simple ways to teach her to behave, even under minor distractions. Click and give her EXTRA rewards for staying under these circumstances.
Okay, now, do you have any other family members that live in your household? Get them to help out. Have them be your 'visitors', by having them go out the front door, and coming in the side door. Before your 'visitor' knocks on the door, ask your dog to sit-stay patiently at the door. If Bailey begins to bark as the 'visitor' knocks, its important that the 'visitor' doesn't leave...that would mean Bailey won. Rather, just calmly tell her "Uh-uh", repeat the command, and place her in the sit if you have to. Have the person knock again. When Bailey is finally remaining calm, which could take a while, give her a treat WHILE the 'visitor' is walking in. It will give her something to dwell on rather then on the visitor (who she already knows well, so you don't have to worry about growling or jumping).
Keep doing this and watch the time that she keeps breaking the stay decrease. Once she's an expert at this, slowly introduce new people. Use a different family member, then maybe your mother who lives a little ways away (that Bailey doesn't see a whole lot, but still knows pretty well), then some other relatives, friends, and slowly move on to less familiar people.
As long as your dog is remaining quiet (even for your immeidate family members), have them click and give her treats that she rarely gets (maybe chopped up sausages). This will make her slowly start to love it when people knock on the door.
Good luck...if you have any other questions, feel free to ask. Just be sure to keep up with the training, and never start to yell at your dog..that will just make everything tense and your dog won't learn that way.
How is she around people when they aren't coming to the door, but just out in public?
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Post by Baileysmom on Aug 9, 2004 12:17:24 GMT -5
Thanks so much for the help! Im trying the down/stay when someone comes tothe door and I put a bag of small treats right by the door so I can be quick with rewarding the good behavior. I can see a very gradual improvement, and I think starting with more familiar people will help too. Bailey pretty much went through jsut basics - there was only her and one other dog in class and she definetely had stay better ...... I could put her in stay and run around and jump and act weird and she wouldnt move, but she occasionally got up from stay if the other dog was clicked Im not sure how "long" is the longest she could do though....... I have also done that outside and walk down the block and she stays really well (very rarely she will get distracted by a person or other dog) as far as how she reacts out in public - thats something we are also working on - she seems kindof scared if people approach. she sometimes barks or growls, but it doesnt seem to be as much an aggressive act than out of fear. with other dogs, if she is on a line she barks and growls and pulls alot, but if she is off she goes up to them and normally starts playing and they have a great time my training instructor said thats very normal because she is more afraid when she is restricted by the line - but ofcourse I cant always jsut let her loose so that can be frustrating. I am kind of guessing that since we got her as a stray from a humane society and dont know her background she prob wasnt socialized real well early on....... I was told to act very excited when we se people so she gets the idea that its a good thing and be careful not to do the "its ok" type thing as it would reinforce that her fear is founded. is this the correct way to go about it, or do you have any other ideas? thanks again!
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Post by Iluvmypup on Aug 9, 2004 12:58:01 GMT -5
You're 100% right. Telling her "Its okay" will just make her fears worse. When out walking your dog, its a good idea to find her 'comfort zone'. That is, find the distance that the person is at that she's okay with. If the person can stand 20 ft away without Bailey getting nervous or aggressive, go with that. If she barks, move on and try a longer distance. Set her up for success. With the help of a friend, neighbor or relative (again, use familiar people at first), have that person walk in the distance that Bailey is OK with. As long as she's being quiet, and walking along, have that person click, drop a treat and then leave. Let Bailey go up to the treat and eat it. Praise her for being so brave. Keep doing this, and eventually make the distance shorter, and try it in new places. Eventually you'll want it to be within 5 ft., but don't move too fast. If she starts growling, walk away and try it a little further. Keep having the 'helper' click and treat as long as Bailey doesn't growl, or act afraid or aggressive. Use extra-special treats for this. Once she's comfortable with someone clicking and dropping a treat at 5 ft, have the person bend down to her level and click and treat. The only difference is, have the person throw the treat within 2 ft. of Bailey so that she has to walk a little closer to the 'helper'. The "helper" should be staying absolutely still, without moving or talking. Once she's comfortable with this, you can have the person put their palm on the ground with their hand open and the most "I just died and went to heaven" treat you have. The person should stay still while offering the treat, and once Bailey eats and it goes back to you, the person can leave. Keep working on this. Even if you never get to the point where Bailey is excited to have someone petting her or going over to her, you can still train her to stay calm and relaxed, since people are good and fun and produce lots of yummy treats. Since you don't know her past, I would keep strangers informed, and that if they want to pet her, if they could please let Bailey approach them, instead of them going up to her. You want Bailey to make the decision if she's comfortable or not, and if she isn't, the person should just offer a treat, and yet if she still doesn't, they should leave. Never force her to approach anyone she's not comfortable with. Best of luck! You sound like such a great 'mom'.
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Post by Baileysmom on Aug 10, 2004 11:57:15 GMT -5
Thank you so much! I am trying to be a "good mom" and train her well, sometimes it is hard getting the rest of the family to follow the same things I do with her though - I have a hubby and 3 kids here also - they try pretty hard and I try to explain the things I do and why (and why not ) but on occasion they get frustrated and angry when she gets into the trash, chews something, etc....... its hard not to, but I really want to help her learn the right way. admittedly also of that is prob my fault becasue I have been lax in crate training her. in the summer there is almost always someone home, so in the few times we are all gone for a little while I dont know whether to crate her (ofcourse I should) or leave her out, in which case she ofcourse gets into things ! anyway- thanks so much for all your help!!
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Post by Iluvmypup on Aug 10, 2004 12:06:56 GMT -5
Yep, crating is always the best option. I know its nice just letting them be loose, but really, I'm sure Bailey would, in the long run, be much happier knowing you guys won't come hom to see an awful mess she made. In the crate, she'll be happy and content with a chew toy near her to chew on. If you'd like to be able to leave her loose one day, you can start by feeding her food in a buster cube (those treat dispensing toys). I did that for one of my dogs who had severe separation anxiety. It kept him occupied, and after a while, I started leaving the house for 5 minutes, and returned to see him still at work. Now I can leave him home for an hour. Thats how long the cube last until he starts destroying things again. Hehe. ;D Keep working hard! It is hard not to get frustrated like you mentioned, but instead of taking it out on Bailey, just place her calmly in her crate while you clean up the mess and promise yourself you'll keep her there the next time you leave. Best of luck! Bailey sounds like she's in the right hands.
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Post by Baileysmom on Aug 10, 2004 14:23:07 GMT -5
Thanks so much It is hard to leave her in the crate - I feel kind of guilty, but it def would be better for all of us I guess I feel more guilty because our older dog (Bongo, a mix from guam) does not have to be crated and he is ok in eihter the house or yard when we are gone...... but then Bongo has his own share of issues because I didnt train him well early on (part of the reason I am determined to get it right now for bailey and us!) I am going to go today and get bailey a "buster cube" (havednt seen that brand..?) or kong toy and keep her in teh crate when we go somewhere thanks again!
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Post by Iluvmypup on Aug 10, 2004 16:27:16 GMT -5
Heres a picture of what the Buster Cube looks like. They're usually best used OUTSIDE of the crate, for when you want to go away for 5-10 minutes at a time. You could put it in the crate, as long as Bailey does fine with it (no eating the plastic...my dog would definately eat it if I weren't there to supervise ;D), but keep an eye on him when he has it at first to make sure he's not an aggressive chewer with it. Kongs are great for inside the crate, if you fill it with something yummy.
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