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Post by Nicole on Apr 9, 2004 9:00:57 GMT -5
Okay, here is what I think my biggest apprehension is. I am missing all of the brain cells that control approximation. I am not kidding and I know it won’t get better. I have cooked for years and people tell me I am a great cook but I need to have an EXACT recipe down to an 1/8 teas of pepper or I freak out. You can’t just tell me to throw some of this in...I need to know exactly how much. My sister in law gives me these great recipes and she will say oh just throw some of that in. And I look at her like your kidding right and after she laughs hysterically she gives me the exact amounts. And I know I won’t improve, because so far I haven’t. With that said, the raw diet is comprised entirely of give some of this with some of that and throw in a bunch of this. Aaaaaaaack. I can’t do that. I don’t have that portion of the brain. And I remember Ann said her dogs stools were getting too bony so she would give more of this. Well I would need to know EXACTLY how much more. Do you understand. This is a brain problem. ;D So if you assumed that Petey is 85 lbs now, can you give me an EXACT diet for 7-10 days with exact amounts of everything (I have a scale) including supplements if necessary starting with food that is not overly gross. And if you say give some broccoli, you have to say 1 stem or 2 not just “some”.
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Post by amyjo on Apr 9, 2004 9:06:46 GMT -5
Give him 2 chicken quarters or (1/2 chicken) daily for 7-10 days. Then report back for more EXACT INSTRUCTION. I don't have a problem with giving exact instructions. I am bossy ;D
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Post by Willow on Apr 9, 2004 9:18:29 GMT -5
;D Yep, Amyjo is right. No need to give veg's, fruits, or supplements...just the chicken. IF it makes you feel better to give some leftover cooked veg's once in awhile, and Petey likes them, go for it, but it's not necessary.
What could be more simple than that? ;D
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Post by Nicole on Apr 9, 2004 9:43:04 GMT -5
You didn't think you were going to get off that easy did you!! Now is that with the skin or without? Does it matter how much it weighs? Do I give half of it in the am and half in the pm? Are you sure that is all I give. And Loey, give SOME veggies..tsk, tsk, tsk...my brain does not compute... How much, what kind, with the chicken or seperately, both in the am and pm, every day or otherwise... I think I would like to give some. If you are both up to this excruciating task ;D meaning that you can't ever stop, I am going to start on April 19 because I am going away from the 15th to the 18th.
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Post by Nicole on Apr 9, 2004 9:55:11 GMT -5
And when you say 1/2 of a chicken, that includes the breast right.
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Post by amyjo on Apr 9, 2004 10:36:19 GMT -5
Just skip the veggies - it's easier! If you really want to do it they should be cooked and mashed and should be no more than a 2-3 tablespoons...veggies take away from the meat which contains the nutrition he REALLY needs.
Leave the skin on....
Technically 1.7 lbs is a good starting point but you don't really need to measure... I have bought chicken quarters in a lot of places - most of them are just under a pound - so two (leg and thigh quarters) would be perfect. You can feed them both at once or one in the am and one pm - that's up to you just like with kibble.
If you do buy chicken whole and cut it up...then yes feed him the breast unless you want it!
I find the quarters are cheaper though - I just got a 10lb bag at walmart for $3.70 which means they were 37 cents per lb...whole chicken was twice that.
You continue on this chicken dealio for 7-10 days because chicken is easy to buy, serve and digest - let his system get used to raw and then we will start adding organs and other meats.
I would be happy to help you - but I don't think it would end up being a "forever" thing....You will gain confidence and will be fully capable of doing this yourself.
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Post by Nicole on Apr 9, 2004 11:06:49 GMT -5
Okay *GASP* I am going to do this starting April 19. I don't want to start before and gross out my pet sitter when we go away. Thanks. I will start my own thread when I begin. *Breathing deeply*... ;D
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Post by amyjo on Apr 9, 2004 11:08:59 GMT -5
SO PROUD of you, SO HAPPY for you and Petey, Grinning really big and doing a happy dance!!!!!!
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Post by Willow on Apr 9, 2004 12:18:41 GMT -5
Glad to hear you are going to take the plunge, Nicki!! Just breathe slowly into a paper bag and you will be fine! ;D
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Post by Nicole on Apr 9, 2004 12:47:13 GMT -5
LOL, there is a thread on the raw list called "re: total newbie" that could be me. Two more questions. Should I cut the chicken quarter up at all. Why do some say you have to supplement..vitamin E, C , oils etc and some say don't. Does the meat have everything you need. I am not really comfortable posting on the rawlist (I am way to stupid about all of this) so I really appreciate your help and support. Thanks
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Post by amyjo on Apr 9, 2004 13:05:36 GMT -5
Nope - do not cut up the quarter - it is safer for the dog whole - the more he chews and has to work the better -in fact if he is a gulper, feed it frozen or half frozen and it will help slow him down.
To answer your question about the supplements - here is the answer from Lonsdale's book - to paraphrase he basically says there is no way you can do it "right" and the danger of over supplementation or wrong supplementation outweighs any possible benifits. The best thing to do is feed a variety of meat and organs (once the dog is acclimated to raw)
Some people say that most of our grain fed meat available in the grocery is too low in omega 3 fatty acids so if you can't/won't feed grass fed animals or fish then you should supplement with fish body oil. That is the ONLY supplement reccomended on the rawfeeding list for healthy dogs. You do not need to worry about this immeadiatley though as you fisrt priority is just to get his system used to one raw protein source (chicken).
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Post by Brooke on Apr 9, 2004 13:14:49 GMT -5
Hey...Laura...isn't broccoli one of those things like grapes you don't want to feed your dog? I think thats one of those that can do organ damage. Lemme look that up again...
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Post by Brooke on Apr 9, 2004 13:20:55 GMT -5
Hmm...ok...not finding all that much. Must not be as bad as I thought. www.vetinfo4dogs.com/dtoxin.html#Broccoli%20toxicityBroccoli toxicity Q and nudge: Dear Mike, This is follow-up on yesterday's conversation just to remind you. If the stuff is a no-no for dogs as well as ex-Pres. Bush, maybe it's worth noting in your web site. Thanks, NvB A: It is always good to remind me of things -- I had forgotten. Broccoli toxicity has been noted in livestock. Apparently in California it is widely available at certain times and the dairy cattle there are fed broccoli due to this. If the percentage of broccoli in the diet exceeds 10% it can cause gastrointestinal upsets and if it exceeds 25% it is fatal. I could not find any references to problems with broccoli in small animals, probably because no one feeds them more than 10% of their diet as broccoli or possibly because they don't have rumens and therefore don't digest the broccoli as thoroughly. The toxic ingredient in broccoli is isothiocyanate and it is reported to be a pretty potent gastrointestinal irritant. So G. might be right. But I did find several references suggesting that broccoli should be fed to pets because of the bioflavinoids in it and their cancer fighting capabilities. So he might be wrong. Personally, I wouldn't worry about it unless you are planning on feeding a lot of broccoli at one time to Kate. But your daughter might want to follow her vet's advice or find out if there is more evidence of toxicity than I can find. Mike Richards, DVM
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Post by Laura on Apr 9, 2004 14:34:47 GMT -5
Why am I not seeing some of these posts ? Anyhoo, broccoli isn't toxic, per se, but Loki's a gasbutt as it is, I wouldn't dare give him it ! And Nicki, good for you! It really is an idiot proof way to feed, you can't make a mistake so don't go crazy weighing it to the ounce .
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Post by Brooke on Apr 9, 2004 18:15:53 GMT -5
How about now??
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